Friday, June 01, 2007

Quick Challenge on the Atonement

Quick Challenge on the Atonement

(I'm in the middle of responding to Godismyjudge's last comment, that included a complex definition of LFW, this little challenge shouldn't be a big diversion from that.)

Here's the challenge, if you believe that this verse:

1 John 2:2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

means that the atonement is universal, i.e. that it was made for the sins of each and every person that ever was or ever will be (excluding, presumably, Christ himself since he was sinless).

If that is you:

1) What was the purpose in God's doing so? What did He hope to accomplish by propitiating universally?

2) Does Scripture state that purpose? If so, where does it state that purpose?

3) Will God accomplish that purpose? If not, why not? Is the answer to "why not" a conflicting purpose?

4) And does the Gospel have the same purpose as the universal propitiation?

Please try to answer the three questions above before continuing to the last section.

Now, if your answers were:

1) To save everyone.

2) Yes.

2 Peter 3:9

3) No. God wants man to have free will. Yes.

4) Yes.


If those were your answers to the questions, then let me ask you this final question:

Given this:

Luke 11:17 But he, knowing their thoughts, said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and a house divided against a house falleth.

Matthew 12:25 And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand:

Mark 3:25 And if a house be divided against itself, that house cannot stand.

And Given this:

Isaiah 55:11 So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.

How can it be that God's own will for humanity is divided against itself, and how can the Gospel fail to accomplish what God pleases?

-Turretinfan
to the Glory of God, at

2 comments:

  1. Hidden OneSunday, June 03, 2007 5:21:00 AM

    "How can it be that God's own will for humanity is divided against itself, and how can the Gospel fail to accomplish what God pleases?"

    Whosoever said that it was God's will (read, preference) that the Gospel divide the world? I see only a prophecy that it would, not that God wanted it to. (Note the difference.)

    Sincerely in Christ,
    a 'wolf'

    ReplyDelete
  2. TurretinfanSunday, June 03, 2007 4:53:00 PM

    Dear "Hidden One,"

    Thanks for your comments.

    Perhaps you need to read what I wrote more carefully. It seems you think that I am saying that it is God's will for humanity to be divided against itself. In fact, I am asking those who suppose that God's will is divided against itself to explain themselves, in view of the fact that the Gospel accomplishes what God pleases.

    I did find your comment nevertheless interesting. The passage you reference is:

    Luke 12:51-53
    51Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division: 52For from henceforth there shall be five in one house divided, three against two, and two against three. 53The father shall be divided against the son, and the son against the father; the mother against the daughter, and the daughter against the mother; the mother in law against her daughter in law, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.

    Jesus does say he came to earth to bring divisions AND he prophesies that there will be divisions.

    But all that is an aside. The point of the post is whether God's own will is internally conflicted (which we deny against the synergists).

    -Turretinfan

    ReplyDelete

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