Thursday, March 20, 2014

Olive Baptist - September 13, 2009

On September 13, 2009, Drs. Emir and Ergun Caner apparently delivered four messages (two each - there was a third speaker who delivered two messages, Paige Patterson) at Olive Baptist:

  • "Contend Earnestly for the Faith" 9:30 AM Service Message Jude 3-4 Dr.Emir Caner (link to mp3)

Emir begins by pointing out that he and Ergun were baptized in the same church (as one another) and called to preach in the same church (as one another).  He then goes on to note that the difference is that Ergun was not born in the U.S., joking that Ergun is an "undocumented worker."

Emir tells the story of an annoying kid who kept after him until he went to church.

  • "Preachers in the Hands of an Angry God" 11 AM Service Message Jeremiah 28 Dr.Ergun Caner (link to mp3)

0:15 "I'm not real good at fakin' it."

I am not sure whether to agree or disagree with this.

1:50 "The only reason that you can understand me, is because God has to constantly break me down. When our family came to this country - Turkish, Immigrant, Yankee, Sunni Muslim, our father raised us with the constant admonition, find a woman, marry a woman who is submissive, who will obey you - and I married a southern belle - that don't work."

The only reason you can understand him is because he came to America from Sweden as a toddler and was raised in Ohio.

2:55 "Her father is from Possum Kill, NC"

We have yet to see any evidence that there is such a place.

3:20 "With a name like Ergun Mehmet Caner, Butch"

His real name is Ergun Michael Caner.  His "Butch" nickname apparently goes back to his college days, before he met his wife.

  • "Global Apologetics" 5 PM Service Message [none] Dr.Ergun Caner (link to mp3)

17:10 "When I debate - and all of our debates are free, got to iTunes or whatever and you type in - and you can download all of our debates, they're all free - but when we debate we have two rules number 1 - nobody gets paid, because what do they say about Christians all the time? it's always about money - so we do our debates - they sign the contract, I sign the contract and it says nobody gets paid - and the second part of it is, no Christians are allowed to ask me questions, because if a Christian asks me a question, it sometimes smells like a setup."

We've previously discussed (here) the items Dr. Caner had up on iTunes.  They weren't debates.  Furthermore, as far as I can tell - these were for classes Caner taught at Liberty.  The description, therefore, doesn't seem to match what we find.

20:30 "I was reached because one kid in high school, loved me for four years the way Christ loved him."

This suggests Caner was saved as a high school senior, which does not match other accounts of his alleged conversion date, or that of his brother.

20:45 "After I became a Christian, I lost my family - I lost everything I loved and owned - I lost everything in one fell swoop."

This doesn't seem very accurate - he seems to have lost only his relationship with his non-custodial father.

21:30 "Jerry came after me for four years. When I finally saw that wall, my name was the last one on his list. And every year he put up a new list, and all of his friends had become Christians except for me."

Again, notice the "four years."  Also, compare with Emir's comments regarding the "annoying kid" which apparently refers to the same Jerry.  Why wasn't Emir on the list if he was always annoying Emir and if Ergun was saved before Emir?  This doesn't seem to make much sense.

22:50 "So, I go into places where they hate me, we sign a contract that says nobody gets paid, no Christians can ask me questions ..." 

Where are any of these contracts?

47:14 "Here's a little encouragement for you middle-schoolers and high-schoolers. I was a straight C, graduated with a 2.0, I graduated number 207 out of 404 people. I was in the random middle of my high school class." 

I question this for a variety of reasons, such as that he seems to have made a similar claim about his undergrad (see here) and because it would be surprising to me if about half the graduating class averaged below a C.

  • "An Audience of One" 6 PM Service Message 1 Kings Dr.Emir Caner (link to mp3)

25:15 "I realize I need to baptize her in Swedish, that's our native tongue. That's what she only spoke. She never spoke English in 30 years, living in this country."

I appreciate that Emir was forthright about the fact that his grandma was Swedish and that his native tongue was Swedish, not "Arabic" or "Turkish" or anything like that.  Still, wouldn't it be good for Emir to come out and say, "Yes, when Ergun pretended that he speaks Arabic or claimed it was his language before English, he was lying."


1 comment:

michael said...

What I'd find refreshing is for Paige Patterson to step to the plate and knock the Caner's ball out of the park! In other words tell the truth about the truth he knows about Dr. Caner he and I discussed a few years ago.