Friday, September 12, 2008

An Inconvenient Conciliar Truth - Part 10

An Inconvenient Conciliar Truth - Part 10

Some folks seem to find relying on councils a comfort. For these folks, there are some inconvenient facts that they must face. This post is the tenth in what has become a multi-part series.

Council of Jerusalem (1672) - Young Christians forbidden to read the Bible, especially the Old Testament

QUESTION I.
Ought the Divine Scriptures to be read in the vulgar tongue by all Christians?
No. For that all Scripture is divinely-inspired and profitable we know, and is of such necessity, that without the same it is impossible to be Orthodox at all. Nevertheless they should not be read by all, but only by those who with fitting research have inquired into the deep things of the Spirit, and who know in what manner the Divine Scriptures ought to be searched, and taught, and in fine read. But to such as are not so exercised, or who cannot distinguish, or who understand only literally, or in any other way contrary to Orthodoxy what is contained in the Scriptures, the Catholic Church, as knowing by experience the mischief arising therefrom, forbiddeth the reading of the same. So that it is permitted to every Orthodox to hear indeed the Scriptures, that he may believe with the heart unto righteousness, and confess with the mouth unto salvation; but to read some parts of the Scriptures, and especially of the Old [Testament], is forbidden for the aforesaid reasons and others of the like sort. For it is the same thing thus to prohibit persons not exercised thereto reading all the Sacred Scriptures, as to require infants to abstain from strong meats.

This council was a regional Eastern Orthodox council (not ecumenical) that rejected various tenets of the Reformation, and denied that the Confession of Cyril Lucar (former Patriarch of Constaninople) was both Orthodox and authentically the product of Cyril (they claimed that it certainly wasn't Orthodox and that it probably wasn't Cyril's).

-TurretinFan

10 comments:

orthodox said...

And the results of letting the ignorant loose on the old testament are Seventh Day Adventists and similar groups. The bible doesn't say for the church to abandon the Saturday Sabbath to exclusively meet on Sunday for example. That's part of the tradition. If you don't know the Christian tradition and go loose on the Jewish law without understanding it in its context, well we see the heretical results.

Turretinfan said...

O wrote: "And the results of letting the ignorant loose on the old testament are Seventh Day Adventists and similar groups. The bible doesn't say for the church to abandon the Saturday Sabbath to exclusively meet on Sunday for example. That's part of the tradition. If you don't know the Christian tradition and go loose on the Jewish law without understanding it in its context, well we see the heretical results. "

Actually, no. The more significant problem with the SDA is the same problem with Eastern Orthodoxy: claims of what amounts to extrascriptural revelation from God.

Yes, certainly Miller's faulty exegesis of Daniel's prophecy didn't help, but the false prophetess Ellen White is really the main driving force behind the SDA existence.

-TurretinFan

Lucian said...

Well, ... I guess there's a reason the ancient Church had the institution of the catechumenate, which to my recollection lasted for entire months and even years. (They didn't just distribute KJV's to them and then let them do each their own thing). -- Or was the whole catechumenate training just Another Brick In The Wall, that Satan put there to corrupt the Church? :-\ Hmm... now, that's a tough one...

orthodox said...

Is there any extra-scriptural revelation?

orthodox said...

Given that even protestants admit the scriptures cannot be interpreted correctly without education concerning their historical context, I would think they should support having a bit of education before tackling them.

Turretinfan said...

Lucian,

Some ancient churches, yes - the apostolic church, no. Recall the Philippian jailor and the Ethiopian Eunuch.

-TurretinFan

Turretinfan said...

O asked: "Is there any extra-scriptural revelation?"

Of course, there is the general revelation of God in the creation, as Scripture mentions. I'm surprised you were unaware of that.

-TurretinFan

Turretinfan said...

O stated: "Given that even protestants admit the scriptures cannot be interpreted correctly without education concerning their historical context, I would think they should support having a bit of education before tackling them."

Actually, Reformed Protestants ("Protestants" is such a sweeping category) preach the Gospel both to the learned and unlearned. Furthermore, we hold to the same doctrine of perspecuity that Chrysostom held to.

-TurretinFan

Jnorm888 said...

Turretinfan,

You didn't answer Orthodoxthougts question. As a former Protestant, that visited alot of different protestant churches, I know that what Orthodox said is true.

It is unwise to let the unlearned to read the Old Testament apart from knowing the Faith first.

In modern times, more and more psuedo-protestant sects are forming and it's all do to this individual supremecy of conscience and individual interpretation, apart from the consences of the historic Faith.




JNORM888

Turretinfan said...

JNORM888,

You wrote: "You didn't answer Orthodoxthougts question."

I did, in fact, answer his question. I didn't give the answer that you and he were hoping for.

You wrote: "As a former Protestant, that visited alot of different protestant churches, I know that what Orthodox said is true."

Appealing to your own authority while in the same breath mentioning the fact that you have already at least once realigned your loyalties is not a particularly compelling ipse dixit. Furthermore, one presumes that in fact you yourself did read the Scriptures prior to arriving at what you think is Orthodoxy. Thus, your personal experience is actually contrary to the claim you are making.

You wrote: "It is unwise to let the unlearned to read the Old Testament apart from knowing the Faith first."

Your judgment is wrong and is inconvenient with Paul's teaching that the Scriptures themselves are able to make one wise unto salvation.

You wrote: "In modern times, more and more psuedo-protestant sects are forming and it's all do to this individual supremecy of conscience and individual interpretation, apart from the consences of the historic Faith."

a) As noted above, it is the principle of private judgment that led you to abandon your previous faith in favor of what you deem Orthodoxy.

b) Actually, Scripture explains both that there always will be divisions, and why there are divisions. The answer is not that private judgment is an incorrect hermeneutic.

-TurretinFan