Monday, June 21, 2010

Second Awal Debate Canceled

The report is here (link to report). The stated reason for refusing to honor his word and debate is so absurd that one wonders if the real reason is the outcome of the first debate. God knows. I look forward to the videos from the first debate being made available.


Pilgrimsarbour said...

When you know you have nothing to offer, you have to make up some excuse not to keep your word. It's merely cowardice.

JIBBS said...

The spin reminds me of a certain man who backed out of a debate with Dr. White a few years back. With everything that's happening in Michigan right now it's as if we've entered the Twilight Zone.

Anonymous said...

I believe this would be a good opportunity to insert a verse, in my view, that reflects what's going on behind the scenes:

Luk 4:13 And when the devil had ended every temptation, he departed from him until an opportune time.

The devil knows to withdraw and draw back until an opportune time!

Our opportunity is now, Jesus said, so we still must remain vigilant and sober advancing the Kingdom Truth one withdrawal at a time!

I do long for this though and then there will be no opportunity left for them to withdraw:

Heb 9:27 And just as it is appointed for man to die once, and after that comes judgment,
Heb 9:28 so Christ, having been offered once to bear the sins of many, will appear a second time, not to deal with sin but to save those who are eagerly waiting for him.

Therefore, I would exhort this:

1Ch 16:31 Let the heavens be glad, and let the earth rejoice, and let them say among the nations, "The LORD reigns!"
1Ch 16:32 Let the sea roar, and all that fills it; let the field exult, and everything in it!
1Ch 16:33 Then shall the trees of the forest sing for joy before the LORD, for he comes to judge the earth.

Anonymous said...

I hope that the Holy Spirit will open the eyes of Muslims who thought their religion was in any sense defensible as truth over and against the only True faith. Hopefully their hearts won't be hardened against the obvious conclusions to be drawn from this: The Bible alone has a monopoly on Truth.


Andrew Suttles said...

James should have shown up anyhow. I think it would make a powerful statement to see one side show up to make an argument and the other side simply not show up.

The events this weekend show that darkness cannot abide the light.

Let us give glory to Jesus Christ that He has honored His name through His faithful servants.

Turretinfan said...

He did show up.

Andrew Suttles said...


I see that now from his blog. Good for him.

Andrew Suttles said...

By the way, the contacts for the city of Dearborn elected officials are here:

thegrandverbalizer19 said...

With the name of God, Peace be unto those who follow the guidance from their Lord.

I wonder what Christians think about this?

As I said in response to James White on the Sheikh Awal situation.

"I wonder why James White and Arabic Christian Perspective would not release these debates with Shabir Ally. If those debates had gone well for the Christian side, would this objection even be offered? I will let you judge that!"

Maybe someone who is close to James White could let us Muslims know when James plans to release the material or make available his debates with Shabir Ally in 2008?

Or what about ALL the deates that James and David did at London Westbourne Park Baptist Church?

We need to have consistent standards if we are to arrive at any meaningful discussion.

A person's scholarship cannot be examined or critiqued if they never release their material.

Turretinfan said...

"We need to have consistent standards if we are to arrive at any meaningful discussion."

I'm confused. What is the standard of behavior that is being inconsistently applied?

Turretinfan said...

For what it is worth, the recordings for these two debates have been obtained, after a long delay, from the videographer:

Is Jesus Prophesied in the OT? vs. Shabir Ally, November 17, 2008, London, England

Is Muhammad Prophesied in the Bible? vs. Shabir Ally, November 17, 2008, London England

The release of DVDs is, as far as I can tell, still planned.


Turretinfan said...

Until they are released, I can offer you this clip: (clip from 2008 debate)

Andrew Suttles said...

>> "I wonder why James White and Arabic Christian Perspective would not release these debates with Shabir Ally."

> "after a long delay, from the videographer..."

So the hold-up was with the videographer. James is always complaining on the DL about how these videos are being held up and how he'd like to release them. I thought the problem was with Ally's people.

I'm glad they'll come out soon...

thegrandverbalizer19 said...

With the name of God, Peace be unto those who follow the guidance from their Lord.

Turretitanfan I'm adding a link to your blog. Your one of the most gutsy Christians around! Hahaha!

I admit I am tickled.

However, just to make it clear we are not only asking for the debates in 2008 with White and Shabir we are also interested in obtaining those done with White and Wood with thier respective Muslim opponents at Westbourne Park Baptist Church.

I tell you it would be a crying shame to miss out where David Wood (one of the four evangelist arrested recently in Dearborn) talks about how he beat his father over the head with a ball penn hammer and was sent to a mental institution before coming to Christ.

I know I know... guilt by association right? But I am just saying...

Any way Tony Costa and Mary Jo Sharp are class acts. Respectful Christian apologist and missionaries no doubt.

However, David Wood and Sam Shamoun I do hope James does some thinking about whom he dines at Red Lobster with.

Turretinfan said...

I don't think Dr. White feels it necessary to publish debates by other Christian debaters. So, perhaps you should contact Mr. Wood about Mr. Wood's debates.

As far as Dr. White's debate(s?) that you are referencing, are those with Adnan Rashid? I believe you can find a recording of that debate here: (link)

Are you looking for something else?


Turretinfan said...

As for the "gutsy" compliment, while I thank you, I do not claim to be courageous.

A follow-up note:

I understand that A&O ministries also hopes to provide their own release of the Rashid debate and also the Zatari debate.

Obviously, the Shabir Ally debate is the first priority, since he's the most prominent.

thegrandverbalizer19 said...

With the name of God, Peace be unto those who follow the guidance from their Lord.

By the way TF I do not hate James White. In fact I think he is a godsend to Muslim apologetics.

Though obviously I differ with him on allot of issues, I myself get a little weary watching fellow Muslims gloat about Ahmed Deedat (may Allah have mercy on him) showing up Christians.

Just as Christians in general are ignorant of our faith we in general are ignorant of Christian faith.

It is nice to have a good counterpoint to keep one sharp.

By the way I do intend to post a blog entry taking Muslims to task for not giving me copies of the Robert Morey/Shabir Ally and Robert Morey/Badawi debates.

Fair is fair. Grace and peace.